[Public politics]Opinions on Forign Policy

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[Public politics]Opinions on Forign Policy

Post by Medrolke on 2011-01-12, 00:12

This isn't a debate about anything, I'm just wondering about people's personal opinions about what Belgium's forign policy should be.

What type of countries do you think we should stick up for? What type of countries should we be looking to join an alliance with? That sort of thing.

As I said, this isn't a debate about what our policy should be, it just seems that my own views are very different to everyone else's, and I'm interested to find out more about what other people think.

Also, please don't just post "we are neutral". If that's all you think then just don't bother.

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Re: [Public politics]Opinions on Forign Policy

Post by Theneka on 2011-01-12, 00:52

I want to quit neutrality and join a large imperialistic group. IF that's not possible, I just want to quit neutrality and if necessairy start a Western European alliance on our own xD
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Re: [Public politics]Opinions on Forign Policy

Post by Fhaemita Malodorous on 2011-01-12, 01:16

I think for now, choosing sides would be unwise.
There is so much happening, countries making new alliances etc etc.
I'd say you wait for now

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Re: [Public politics]Opinions on Forign Policy

Post by shadowukcs on 2011-01-12, 07:03

Fhaemita Malodorous wrote:I think for now, choosing sides would be unwise.
There is so much happening, countries making new alliances etc etc.
I'd say you wait for now

this


and if you have to choose sides, it's better to chose sides with strong countries in this stage than with small weak countries. Poland for example would be great to be close friends as they can actually offer us something. No offence to Antiko, but what can Holland possibly offer us that ePoland can't do 10 times bigger and better? (and by that I don't say that we shouldn't help them, just a honest question)
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Re: [Public politics]Opinions on Forign Policy

Post by Mikhail Alexander on 2011-01-12, 07:20

I think we should choose sides, if we are attacked, no one will help us because we have no allies, if we choose a side we may get help or the battle against us won't happen because they will become our allies.
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Re: [Public politics]Opinions on Forign Policy

Post by shadowukcs on 2011-01-12, 08:35

Rowan Quigley wrote:I think we should choose sides, if we are attacked, no one will help us because we have no allies, if we choose a side we may get help or the battle against us won't happen because they will become our allies.

I disagree

No alliances have been formed and big players are very jumpy to forget their friends (just look at Oz and USA, Poland and Hungary, USA and sweden,...) Choosing sides now will almost certainly get us stabbed in the back sooner or later. For now it's better to hang out with the big countries, without actually siding with them.

When things have settled down and alliances have been formed properly, then we can pick a side. At this moment tho, situations and friendships are changing by the day
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Re: [Public politics]Opinions on Forign Policy

Post by Mikhail Alexander on 2011-01-12, 09:38

shadowukcs wrote:
Rowan Quigley wrote:I think we should choose sides, if we are attacked, no one will help us because we have no allies, if we choose a side we may get help or the battle against us won't happen because they will become our allies.

I disagree

No alliances have been formed and big players are very jumpy to forget their friends (just look at Oz and USA, Poland and Hungary, USA and sweden,...) Choosing sides now will almost certainly get us stabbed in the back sooner or later. For now it's better to hang out with the big countries, without actually siding with them.

When things have settled down and alliances have been formed properly, then we can pick a side. At this moment tho, situations and friendships are changing by the day

Well, either we choose a side and get no help or have no side and get no help, which would you prefer?
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Re: [Public politics]Opinions on Forign Policy

Post by shadowukcs on 2011-01-12, 10:18

Rowan Quigley wrote:
Well, either we choose a side and get no help or have no side and get no help, which would you prefer?

Neither of them. Neutrality is what usually keeps you safe. Combine that with friendly relations (not choosing sides) with the top military powers in erep and a MPP with one or two of them, and you will still get help without being forced to pick a side.
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Re: [Public politics]Opinions on Forign Policy

Post by Mikhail Alexander on 2011-01-12, 10:24

shadowukcs wrote:
Rowan Quigley wrote:
Well, either we choose a side and get no help or have no side and get no help, which would you prefer?

Neither of them. Neutrality is what usually keeps you safe. Combine that with friendly relations (not choosing sides) with the top military powers in erep and a MPP with one or two of them, and you will still get help without being forced to pick a side.

I'm sick of being neutral most the countries I've lived in were neutral. Can we please join a alliance and join the rest of the heard.
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Re: [Public politics]Opinions on Forign Policy

Post by shadowukcs on 2011-01-12, 10:39

Rowan Quigley wrote:
shadowukcs wrote:
Rowan Quigley wrote:
Well, either we choose a side and get no help or have no side and get no help, which would you prefer?

Neither of them. Neutrality is what usually keeps you safe. Combine that with friendly relations (not choosing sides) with the top military powers in erep and a MPP with one or two of them, and you will still get help without being forced to pick a side.

I'm sick of being neutral most the countries I've lived in were neutral. Can we please join a alliance and join the rest of the heard.

What heard? PHX has fallen and apart from a few "old" friendships between former PHX nation (of which we aren't part of) there isn't really a "side".

And if there where, it be stupid to pick one now unless you can find a way to invite 20k Belgians here and make us one of the top nations in Europe.

Picking sides means you're stuck to your camp of allies. When something bad happens and they can't/won't defend you, you're screwed. Just look at Oz when EDEN got bored of constantly helping them from eIndo attacks. (granted, they had no other choice but to join EDEN, my point is that they are fully dependent of them.)

If we're neutral, but in good standing with everyone, we can play sides up against each other. EDEN attacks? No problem, we'll go to friendly PHX nations and ask them for help. PHX attacks? No problem, we'll go to EDEN.

The Truth is that we simply don't have the manpower, nor the strength, nor the gold and nor do we have the resources, to afford ourselves to pick a side. Especially not before the first new alliances are being created.

If you're sick of being neutral, you should have moved to eUSA in stead of the country that's been claiming neutrality for the past year.
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Re: [Public politics]Opinions on Forign Policy

Post by Glenn Wauters on 2011-01-12, 10:52

shadowukcs wrote:
Rowan Quigley wrote:I think we should choose sides, if we are attacked, no one will help us because we have no allies, if we choose a side we may get help or the battle against us won't happen because they will become our allies.

I disagree

No alliances have been formed and big players are very jumpy to forget their friends (just look at Oz and USA, Poland and Hungary, USA and sweden,...) Choosing sides now will almost certainly get us stabbed in the back sooner or later. For now it's better to hang out with the big countries, without actually siding with them.

When things have settled down and alliances have been formed properly, then we can pick a side. At this moment tho, situations and friendships are changing by the day

+1
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Re: [Public politics]Opinions on Forign Policy

Post by Fhaemita Malodorous on 2011-01-12, 12:11

shadowukcs wrote:
What heard? PHX has fallen and apart from a few "old" friendships between former PHX nation (of which we aren't part of) there isn't really a "side".

And if there where, it be stupid to pick one now unless you can find a way to invite 20k Belgians here and make us one of the top nations in Europe.

Picking sides means you're stuck to your camp of allies. When something bad happens and they can't/won't defend you, you're screwed. Just look at Oz when EDEN got bored of constantly helping them from eIndo attacks. (granted, they had no other choice but to join EDEN, my point is that they are fully dependent of them.)

If we're neutral, but in good standing with everyone, we can play sides up against each other. EDEN attacks? No problem, we'll go to friendly PHX nations and ask them for help. PHX attacks? No problem, we'll go to EDEN.

The Truth is that we simply don't have the manpower, nor the strength, nor the gold and nor do we have the resources, to afford ourselves to pick a side. Especially not before the first new alliances are being created.

If you're sick of being neutral, you should have moved to eUSA in stead of the country that's been claiming neutrality for the past year.

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Re: [Public politics]Opinions on Forign Policy

Post by Mikhail Alexander on 2011-01-12, 13:02

If we are attacked no one will help us. I know its not a good thing but if we are attacked, who do you think cares about us enough to waste money and supplies to save us.
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Re: [Public politics]Opinions on Forign Policy

Post by Glenn Wauters on 2011-01-12, 13:13

Also: Opinions on Foreign Policy Twisted Evil
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Re: [Public politics]Opinions on Forign Policy

Post by Jorne Reynders on 2011-01-12, 13:14

what about germany ? ( KONRAD Smile )
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Re: [Public politics]Opinions on Forign Policy

Post by Glenn Wauters on 2011-01-12, 13:21

Jorne Reynders wrote:what about germany ? ( KONRAD Smile )

*looks at world map*
You mean the Germany that is teared apart by Slovakia, Poland and Sweden?
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Re: [Public politics]Opinions on Forign Policy

Post by Jorne Reynders on 2011-01-12, 13:27

yup that germany
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Re: [Public politics]Opinions on Forign Policy

Post by ThomasRED on 2011-01-12, 17:25

Rowan Quigley wrote:If we are attacked no one will help us. I know its not a good thing but if we are attacked, who do you think cares about us enough to waste money and supplies to save us.

Look at eNL... Who helped them ? National armies ? No... Indivual players (from allies country mostly, it's right).

But did they waste money and supplies to help eNL ? I don't know.
eNL have spent a huge amount of gold to supply the foreign tanks, and also donated lot's of tank and q5 food.

Which can also explain why they were so many tanks to help them : who refuse a free fight with gold donations and supplies ?

This post is not about eNL, but to show that your point is not correct.

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Re: [Public politics]Opinions on Forign Policy

Post by MaryamQ on 2011-01-12, 19:38

Germany is one of our neighbors, and I would like to see us on good terms with all our neighbors, but (even though I like Konrad too), I doubt that they would or could offer us much protection in the long run. I do think it may be necessary to pick a side at some point, but now there is not even really a "side" to pick.
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Re: [Public politics]Opinions on Forign Policy

Post by Glenn Wauters on 2011-01-12, 20:46

ThomasRED wrote:
Rowan Quigley wrote:If we are attacked no one will help us. I know its not a good thing but if we are attacked, who do you think cares about us enough to waste money and supplies to save us.

Look at eNL... Who helped them ? National armies ? No... Indivual players (from allies country mostly, it's right).

But did they waste money and supplies to help eNL ? I don't know.
eNL have spent a huge amount of gold to supply the foreign tanks, and also donated lot's of tank and q5 food.

Which can also explain why they were so many tanks to help them : who refuse a free fight with gold donations and supplies ?

This post is not about eNL, but to show that your point is not correct.

This is true, I heard about a tank factory donating loads of gold to the militairy, probably all wasted on noobtube kills
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Re: [Public politics]Opinions on Forign Policy

Post by Xgentis Lempereur on 2011-01-12, 21:52

We should leen toward the countries that truly matters like ePoland, Serbia, eUSA, Hungary in short stay on the good side of the superpowers.
I rather piss off the eNl that pause no real threat thenpiss off any off thoses country that can erase us for lulz.
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Re: [Public politics]Opinions on Forign Policy

Post by shadowukcs on 2011-01-12, 22:39

Rowan Quigley wrote:If we are attacked no one will help us. I know its not a good thing but if we are attacked, who do you think cares about us enough to waste money and supplies to save us.

not picking sides=/=making no friends


We have good relations with france, a mpp with eUSA,... And we always have the "poor neutral country"-card we can play
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Re: [Public politics]Opinions on Forign Policy

Post by mittekemuis on 2011-01-12, 23:04



not picking sides=/=making no friends

not picking sides=/=making no enemies

Our profile of friendly little country fits us just fine!I think we could continue on like this for awhile.

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Re: [Public politics]Opinions on Forign Policy

Post by Medrolke on 2011-01-12, 23:14

at the moment, we're a small neutral country that has done absolutly nothing to show that it diserves any help from anyone.

In all seriousness, Poland has allready proved that the US will do f**k all if we're invaded and how much do you really think Poland will fight for us?

Countrys like France, UK, Germany and NL may acually be willing to help us in the future, so I'd rather have good relations with them.

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Re: [Public politics]Opinions on Forign Policy

Post by Xgentis Lempereur on 2011-01-12, 23:28

Actualy the US say that to everyone in Europe. Who say we can not have good relations with them. I actualy care about our neutrality stance.
And why ePoland didn't wipe us out completely for the price they pay for DoW.
Should we give them excuse to make them regret their decision.
Siding with eNl not only is pointless and won't change anything it's also dangerous. We all know that ePoland can old a grudge for a long time. I am pretty sure that they use the game to get revenge from the RL WWII.
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Re: [Public politics]Opinions on Forign Policy

Post by LeValeureuxLiegeois on 2011-01-12, 23:56

Medrolke wrote:Countrys like France, UK, Germany and NL may acually be willing to help us in the future, so I'd rather have good relations with them..

I agree with this statement. We have some good contacts and talks with those countries and our embassies there are active.

Our Ambassadors will do heir best to keep nice relationship with them and if possible, improve them.

Right now, we should keep all opportunities opened and take part in some meetings to get more and better informations about all potential alliance emerging.

On a personal perspective, I have always supported an alliance of countries from Western Europe or some NATO countries, which maintain a good cooperation for a long time.
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Re: [Public politics]Opinions on Forign Policy

Post by Mikhail Alexander on 2011-01-13, 00:32

But I want to make friends, I want to make enemies, come on lets take a risk sure we may well regret it but we may have a little fun along the way. If we are invaded, we can get ourselves back on our feet!
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Re: [Public politics]Opinions on Forign Policy

Post by Fhaemita Malodorous on 2011-01-13, 07:45

Rowan Quigley wrote:But I want to make friends, I want to make enemies, come on lets take a risk sure we may well regret it but we may have a little fun along the way. If we are invaded, we can get ourselves back on our feet!

It's not all about what you want, it's about what good for the country.
And I agree that we need to work on relation with our surrounding countries.

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Re: [Public politics]Opinions on Forign Policy

Post by Mikhail Alexander on 2011-01-13, 08:19

Fhaemita Malodorous wrote:
Rowan Quigley wrote:But I want to make friends, I want to make enemies, come on lets take a risk sure we may well regret it but we may have a little fun along the way. If we are invaded, we can get ourselves back on our feet!

It's not all about what you want, it's about what good for the country.
And I agree that we need to work on relation with our surrounding countries.

I know its not about me but my opinion is welcome, whether it will be accepted or taken into account is up to the rest of the country. Smile
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Re: [Public politics]Opinions on Forign Policy

Post by Glenn Wauters on 2011-01-13, 11:11

Xgentis Lempereur wrote:Actualy the US say that to everyone in Europe. Who say we can not have good relations with them. I actualy care about our neutrality stance.
And why ePoland didn't wipe us out completely for the price they pay for DoW.
Should we give them excuse to make them regret their decision.
Siding with eNl not only is pointless and won't change anything it's also dangerous. We all know that ePoland can old a grudge for a long time. I am pretty sure that they use the game to get revenge from the RL WWII.

Then what have The Netherlands and Belgium to do with WWII
We were also occupied by Germany?
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Re: [Public politics]Opinions on Forign Policy

Post by shadowukcs on 2011-01-13, 14:49

Medrolke wrote:at the moment, we're a small neutral country that has done absolutly nothing to show that it diserves any help from anyone.

In all seriousness, Poland has allready proved that the US will do f**k all if we're invaded and how much do you really think Poland will fight for us?

Countries like France, UK, Germany and NL may acually be willing to help us in the future, so I'd rather have good relations with them.


At the time when Poland invaded, the cards on the table where completely different:
A) Poland and eUSA where still good friends. They still are friends, but the situation is changing
B) We didn't ask the US for help. They where under the impression that this was a organised passage (as the polish MoD article stated, even tho it wasn't)
C) Why would they waste resources on protecting a region from an ally that has promised to RW it back 2 days later?

As for your countries:
France: I agree. Good relations with them would deffo be good.
UK: okey, relations with them *could* be good as they have many international politicians and they *could* be involved in the making of new alliances
Germany: throughout it's entire history, eGermany has been a battlefield. It has had more days of attacks and being conquered than it has had days of peace. Germany is DEFFO NOT the country you want to be big friends with. They are hated by Sweden, hated by Poland,... Becoming allies with them means "bye-bye neutrality" for sure.
NL: Some relations with them would be good. But I would definitely NOT prefer them over Poland or stronger nations. Lets face it. I like Antiko, but what can his country offer us? What's the benefit we get from risking our necks and putting our country on the line? Nothing.


ppl need to stop thinking in therms of RL friendships or in therms of who they like on IRC and look more to raw facts.


I think I can say that I know a thing or two about alliances and foreign affairs in this game, and I guarantee you: side with eNL, eGermany and the rest of Europe's weak countries, and you'll end up in EntenteV2.
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Re: [Public politics]Opinions on Forign Policy

Post by Xgentis Lempereur on 2011-01-13, 16:56

+1 shadowukcs.
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Re: [Public politics]Opinions on Forign Policy

Post by Oboacer on 2011-01-16, 22:15

I thought I might be able to add my two cents to this debate as we had the same situation in eNZ nearly a month ago. Our nation, like your choose to adopt a neutral foreign policy and we have benefited.

We have Indo on our doorsteps and Chile/Brazil on the other. This makes us have to balance the powers and neutrality has allowed us to do that. Make no mistake, by remaining neutral but having MPP's with countries like ePoland, eSerbia and eFrance it enables you to benefit greatly. You don't end up pissing anyone off.

However, I'm speaking from my experience in eNZ which is a different international situation then you here in Western Europe.

Great discussion though!
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