HOPE for better eBelgium

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HOPE for better eBelgium

Post by MarkoKlis on 2013-10-28, 12:12

In past few days I try to explain what and why everything happen, wanted to ask for more fairer immigration laws after all accused members of HOPE for "PTO", try to cooperate with gov and respect the law, although he is not fair.

Since no one wants to talk with me, putting proposal law about fairer immigration law makes no sense!

I will write again: The ruling parties have a majority in congress, and every time legalize their approved CS's for their new members, but STOPed CS of HOPE. So they accuse us for "PTO" if we use our CS!

I gave you a hand of friendship, but in last article of government you piss on me and my friends!

If you believe that the events that occurred "PTO", like helping PANDA who are "sister party" of HOPE by members of HOPE, and if it is all true that Cika Nikola was a spy, I want to ask who put him on position where is he now!? How someone who came just before some time won on elections?
The true is that he led all that actions, beg members of HOPE for HELP, just only to win PP and also beg for members to push his party in TOP 5 on day of election, just like he begging for CS of his friend!
I want to ask one more question, why he dont published article last month when PM was not deleted by admin, then we can see all true?

If you dont want to talk with me and dont want to debate about unfair law, then I have nothing to look for here!

From now I have ingame rules and nobody can accuse me for using them! If members of my party choose me on election, then I have obligation for them not for you EVIL and RACIST peoples who comes from all of the eWorld!
You are same like Christijan, you are not better than him!

And how the FU** 5 men can PTO country with 500 peoples?

Regards

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Re: HOPE for better eBelgium

Post by Kiyonori Dragnier on 2013-10-28, 12:39

Dear Marko Klis,

Please calm down, no one here is a racist, everything is based on facts and how every one used their CS and are related to.

Bitting everything won't help, like I told in many articles we have a bad reputation yes but they don't block every CS related to HOPE members, the fact is that the current immigration officer is a HOPE member !

It just prove that people here aren't denying automatically every CS request that are related to us.

I'll be honest, it will take a lot of time to be able to work normally without being called PTOers or anything.

If a CS was blocked there was reasons to it, you knew about what ChristijanXD and the others were doing that it would answer most of your questions.

Working on a proposal take time and a lot of preparation (if we want it to be successful)

Also the fact we have an Immigration Officer proved in the past that the system is really helping at protecting a country.

If someone get his CS as soon as the person applies and get his CS without everyone was able to see it on the list it would mean something suspicious we don't know is happening.

Many countries works with this system and it proved to be efficient at least to verify is someone is suspicious or not. (Don't you think that someone who enter by force is legit? I don't think so.)

Myself I was Immigration officer for many consecutive months and I was able to detect threats out of some application. I can also tell you that immigration officers are free to decide about the applications and that no one except the IO itself is able to take the final decision.

For me Immigration is a part of national security, I know to some people it could be unfair but if we want to have a real system and protection we need to have laws, without law there's only chaos and the strongest rules.

If we had no law about immigration every parties would be able to do what they want like making a lot of people enter to have more members.

This rules applies to everyone.

Also this is not big deal to have an IO, I mean if someone really want to enter in eBE he just have to contact the IO and give as much information as possible, if not talking with an IO helps.

Most of people doesn't even try to talk with an IO, I know this by experience, they just wait to get accepted by someone.

Trust me this is the truth, if an application is rejected by the IO (I want to remind you that the IO is the only one that can give a final answer) it's because the applicant showed that he didn't want to cooperate by answering the questions asked by the IO.

I could talk a lot about the subject but this isnt the right time, perhaps I should do it in an article... hmm what a nice idea I could make an article about my experience in immigration to explain that no one is blocking the CS, this has nothing to do with "the majority".

Also I want to add that it's the external people that have to adapt themselve to a country system instead of the country to adapt to every person... It's not about congress, majority or anything it's about the country itself.
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Re: HOPE for better eBelgium

Post by Vincent Pain on 2013-10-28, 14:08

Marko is a good person, not a powerhungry freak like Cika
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Re: HOPE for better eBelgium

Post by MaryamQ on 2013-10-28, 14:57

MarkoKlis wrote:In past few days I try to explain what and why everything happen, wanted to ask for more fairer immigration laws after all accused members of HOPE for "PTO", try to cooperate with gov and respect the law, although he is not fair.
I'm sorry I did not respond to your previous post yet. I was indeed glad to see you had come to the forum to try to talk. I understand that some people think the law is unfair, but let's take a look at what it really says.

Current Immigration law wrote: All immigration requests shall be reviewed by an Immigration Officer, to be appointed by vote of Congress, and the Minister of National Security, to be appointed by the current President of eBelgium. The Immigration Officer shall be appointed for a term of three months and may serve for an unlimited number of consecutive terms.

A thread shall be opened in the immigration subforum for each request. Congress members may comment about these requests and vouch for any potential citizens who are known to them. Within 48 hours, sooner if they feel they have sufficient information, the IO and MoNS will post their advice to accept or reject the request. If the advice is to reject, a reason will be given.

According to game mechanics, Congress members may accept any request. However, on the 24th of each month, the IO shall make a report, published by the government, showing who made requests, the advice of the IO and MoNS, and, if the citizenship was given, who gave it and from what party. This report should not include further comment, positive or negative, about these cases.
As you can see, all Congress members are encouraged to comment about the requests. The decision is made by the Immigration Officer - currently a member of HOPE who is very open-minded and reluctant to reject people without really sollid reasons - and the MoNS. If HOPE and PANDA members would come to the immigration section and comment in an objective way, rather than shouting that their friends must be accepted and everyone else's rejected, their influence would be much greater.

Also, there is no other penalty given for noncompliance, other than publication in a national newspaper. Unfortunately, those publications have not been made until this most recent article, and that article included all of the illegal passes given for the last several months, even though some of those people are not believed to be a threat.

Marko Klis wrote:I gave you a hand of friendship, but in last article of government you piss on me and my friends!
What was posted in that government article was straight fact. Everyone can see who accepted who if they take the time to look at the right pages in game. I can understand that you don't like being included in this publication, but there is hard evidence against some people in that list that they were intending to PTO our country. If you don't want to be included in that, it would be better to distance yourself from those people, instead of defending them as your "friends". Can you really blame people for being suspicious that you are part of this group if you were one of three admitted illegally just in time for the Congress list, were immediately moved to the top of the party list, and admitted someone else illegally as soon as the election was over? We knew from the day he entered the country that Christijan was a known PTOer with multiple attempts in other countries. Your intentions may not be bad, but you were keeping bad company.

Marko Klis wrote:From now I have ingame rules and nobody can accuse me for using them! If members of my party choose me on election, then I have obligation for them not for you EVIL and RACIST peoples who comes from all of the eWorld!
Again, the accusations against others are not helping you. As you yourself say, we come from all over the eWorld, so in what way can we be shown to be racist? This community is normally cautious about newcomers, because experience has shown that is necessary, but people that try to work within the system are accepted as a part of the community no matter where they come from, and they are given opportunities as soon as they show they can be trusted. Examples? I was in Congress and in government in June after having entered the country in April, and I was elected by a wide margin as CP in October 2010. El1teBE, a Macedonian, entered the country as an unknown at the same time a real PTO attempt was made by other Macedonians. That attempt was defeated quickly, and they left, but he stayed, worked hard for the good of eBe, and very probably would have been elected CP himself a few months later if RL circumstances hadn't intervened.

With regard to Cika, your arguments about him would make sense IF he weren't undercover. Since he was, and he was known to be by a few members of our community almost as soon as he entered the country, he needed to act as if he belonged in order to get the information he got. That is how being undercover works. At the same time he was doing this, he was doing nothing to harm the country, and many things to help it. Neither he nor Woxczbg has accepted a single illegal citizen in the months they have been here. If he hadn't "come in from the cold" this weekend, would you still be making accusations against him?

I, for one, am still willing to discuss with you exactly how we are being unfair, and would be willing to work with you to make things more fair, but please, provide us with facts, not with accusations that are not backed up with evidence.
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Re: HOPE for better eBelgium

Post by Yannis on 2013-10-28, 15:37

Marko, I will repeat, I am the Immigration Officer, I am in charge of deciding who gets in and who not.

Also, I am a HOPE member and have no will to help majority strengthen their power in such a way. ANY HOPE member was free to contact me to ask if it was OK to accept a citizen. I repeated that over and over again for the past 2 months!

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Re: HOPE for better eBelgium

Post by Director9 on 2013-10-28, 17:04

MarkoKlis wrote:
...From now I have ingame rules and nobody can accuse me for using them!...
[evilmode=ON]Not a lot will change then Twisted Evil [/evilmode]

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Re: HOPE for better eBelgium

Post by MarkoKlis on 2013-10-28, 19:16

Thank you Mary and Kiyo for detailed answers, but I for now stay with my statement! Like you said, you disagree with me about law immigration and I dont have any will to debate about that!

And I do not have any intent to be in any government! Just I said here my opinion and try to protect the interests of my party or part of people in my party!

My intent are clean! I am here now and not going anywhere, and for that time I want to do everything it is in my possibility to make this community more better place for all of us!

Cika Nikola was stimulate all the events that have occurred only to put his A** on place where is he now, he led all that actions and now if you consider that evens like PTO, he done it!

Also you have right to do everything you want to do, you have support of majority!

I just HOPE for better cooperation all of us in future!


Yannis thank you for that, but I already answer to you about that issue!

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Re: HOPE for better eBelgium

Post by Kiyonori Dragnier on 2013-10-28, 19:45

Well the best I can do is to give you a detailed and complete answer, I always try to keep an objective way of thinking and not letting my preferences dictate my thoughts.

You know that if you need to discuss or anything I'm always here and I will always try to answer you the most neutral and correct way possible.

I'm pretty sure that you can do something good, perhaps there too much tension right now and you should think a little more to what happened and if people are really closing doors to you or not.

Like I said it will take time before the community will become a better place for everyone, HOPE included. Don't give up your HOPE to see this happens Wink
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